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13 July 2013 @ 11:10 pm
The Great Cookie Monster Thread.  
An item that started back during the 2012 Presidential race grew into a truly epic thread.  I have had people ask me to find it again which can be hard to do with old threads on FaceBook.

Well, I found it.  Wasn't able to figure out how to share or link to the thread itself so I figured to just copy it here.

Enjoy.

It started with this picture.  Someone posted it on FB and I shared it with the following comment:

1) Sesame Street predates government funding of PBS and thus could quite well survive the cessation of said funding.

2) Even if Sesame Street were to fold, as other Children's shows have done over the years (do you remember Romper Room? Captain Kangaroo?) in the world where cable and satellite are ubiquitous, in a world with "Learning Channels" and "Discovery Channels" and many another, it's loss, while not without a nostalgic sadness, would hardly be the end of the world.

3) Please show me what clause in the Constitution which makes paying for educational television a responsibility of the Federal Government. I can show you the clauses that put military expenditures into that category. We're broke as a nation and need to cut spending. Things that _aren't_ Constitutional responsibilities _should_ be cut, certainly before things that _are_.

4) That the Federal Government can, and should cut back toward what its actual Constitutional responsibilities are is, in fact, a _wonderful_ lesson to be teaching America's children.


GAR


Tim Covington Considering all of the merchandising/licensing involved with Sesame Street, I have a hard time believing it would ever go away. It would just move to one of the kids's channels and have advertising scattered throughout the show instead of the 10 minutes at the end of the hour.
August 23, 2012 at 7:22am • Unlike • 6

David Burkhead "ever" is a long time. Some awfully popular shows have had their day and finally went away but still, I don't think its in any immediate danger even if 1) PBS loses federal funding and 2) as a result PBS goes away (not a certainty even in the event of "1").
August 23, 2012 at 7:34am • Like

Doug Burbey Isn't it about time Sesame Street start using their product marketing royalties and pay for their own damn show? Where's all that toy money go anyway? Bet it's not back to the treasury.
August 23, 2012 at 7:35am • Unlike • 5
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Quilly Mammoth In 1977 Chil;dren's televisdi
August 23, 2012 at 7:42am • Like
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Quilly Mammoth In 1977 Children's television workshop bought several small cable operators across the US with help from the Ford Foundation. Shortly thereafter CTW never took another grant for Sesame Street. The only funds that CTW ever took from the Dept of Ed were for studies to find how effective the process was. Info they then used to hit up the large foundations for money.
August 23, 2012 at 7:45am • Unlike • 3
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Brad Torgersen Because defunding muppets is MEAN! That's pretty much the only argument. Speaking as someone who worked a lot in community radio, I see plusses and minuses to defunding PBS. The core question is one I've never been able to answer: why should public broadcasters with a political agenda be funded by taxpayer dollars from taxpayers who disagree with that political agenda? The answer is: they shouldn't. Which gets us back to: defunding muppets is MEAN!
August 23, 2012 at 9:53am • Unlike • 5
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James L Short • 7 mutual friends
So you would be more supportive of teaching children war than reading? Or just fund war more than education?
August 23, 2012 at 10:03am • Like
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Gary Roulston James L. Just proved Brad Torgersen's point!
August 23, 2012 at 10:56am • Like • 2
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Phil Sevetson I believe that PBS will survive elimination of Government funding. I also suspect that the people who are gunning for it now will start going after broadcast licenses of the stations, next. I don't think "get government funding out of PBS" is the end-game. I suspect we'll see in the next four years, if Romney manages to pull this one out.
August 23, 2012 at 11:01am • Unlike • 1
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Lin Wicklund I turned Sesame Street off when Baby Bear and an adult told my kids that I didn't love them enough to want to go to work and put them in day care. That only loving mothers put their kids in day care, and the other mothers didn't love their kids enough to go to work.
August 23, 2012 at 11:01am • Unlike • 9
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Lin Wicklund Nothing, mind you, about two-parent families where one parent went to work and the other parent loved their children enough to stay home.
August 23, 2012 at 11:02am • Unlike • 4
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David Burkhead James L Short, fallacy of insufficient options. How about teaching children _civics_ (it used to be a subject in school) covering things like separation of powers, Constitutional powers and responsibilities (including actually reading the document), and so forth. Also, defunding PBS is not the same thing as not teaching children reading. My daughter pretty much never watched Sesame Street (or any PBS for that matter). It just didn't interest her (shocking, I know) and yet she reads well enough at eight that "grade level" is meaningless. How is that possible without Sesame Street and PBS? Very easily, actually.

BTW, the Sesame Worksho (formerly Childrend Television Workshop) is self-funded by merchandising et al. It doesn't rely on grants. It doesn't rely on PBS. In a world with The Science Channel, The History Channel, The Discovery Channel, The Learning Channel, A&E, Nickelodean, and many more I doubt Sesame Street would be more than temporarily inconvenienced by PBS losing federal funding.

And that's the way it should be.
August 23, 2012 at 11:05am • Like • 10
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Larry Correia Yeah, Brad... Do you still beat your wife?! Jerk.
August 23, 2012 at 11:39am • Unlike • 8
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Larry Correia
August 23, 2012 at 11:39am • Unlike • 5
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Jon Summers • Friends with Oleg Volk and 1 other
I am going to use an argument I have seen elsewhere here and just change the name to fit....
"Why are *Muppets* discussing politics?!?"
August 23, 2012 at 11:48am • Like • 6
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John David Handley • 2 mutual friends
James: if the only way your kids are learning to read is via a tv show, may I suggest you're a shit parent and no amount of federal waste will correct that.
August 23, 2012 at 11:48am • Unlike • 12
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Mackey Chandler If corporations are people then surely muppets can be 'arrested' and indefinitely detained or rendered to other jurisdictions and questioned until the stuffing comes out...
August 23, 2012 at 11:48am • Like • 2
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Larry Correia Except Cookie Monster. Because that dude is a straight up hard core operator... Conservative too.
August 23, 2012 at 11:49am • Unlike • 16
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Peter Barrett • 7 mutual friends
Maybe Grover should get a productive job instead of having armed agents of the state steal his funding from the productive class at gunpoint.
August 23, 2012 at 11:50am • Unlike • 11
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Larry Correia And Cookie Monster is in favor of teaching war rather than reading. The dude is a freaking killing machine. He was in my mercenary company in Bosnia. I saw Cookie Monster massacre a whole village once... We paid him in cookies.
August 23, 2012 at 11:52am • Unlike • 27
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Nick Gardner Speaking for myself, I'd rather have freedom than Grover.
Just sayin'
August 23, 2012 at 11:55am via mobile • Unlike • 10
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Larry Correia It was after the village massacre in Sbrzjkhginvinia that Cookie Monster got on that weird health kick where he only ate vegetables. I think he just saw too much killing. It can change a puppet... He was messed up, riddled with PTSD. His nightmares were of blood... and cookies...
August 23, 2012 at 11:57am • Unlike • 28
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Travis Beck That crazy blue bastard has a huge switchblade that he named "Snickerdoodle". The things he uses it for...not even Oscar deserves that!
August 23, 2012 at 11:59am via mobile • Like • 5
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David Burkhead Thank you Larry Correia. Seems after you commented here I get a number of likes from XXX (Friend with Larry Correia)
August 23, 2012 at 11:59am • Like • 8
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Dick Besser • Friends with Oleg Volk and 3 others
Lots of cable and network TV shows have been axed because they are not economically viable, no matter how entertaining they may have been. Why should tax dollars support public TV which has become either not watched or a nest of liberal vipers who know that many parents are off working and partying so no one is civilizing their children who then are easy to indoctrinate with mushy non thinking emotional driven BS.
August 23, 2012 at 11:59am • Like • 1
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Larry Correia But then we pulled Cookie Monster out of retirement. Zubara was heating up. We needed his particular set of skills. Part of me feels guilty... I'm the man that put that bag of snickerdoodles in front of him. I'm the one that dragged him back in. I remember, when he looked at me with his big, sad, googley eyes and said "COOKIE? ME LIKE COOKIE? ME KILL TERRORISTS. NOM NOM NOM NOM." and the next thing I knew, we were sitting on a rooftop, watching bad guys through the twenty power scope on top of a Barrett M82...
August 23, 2012 at 12:00pm • Like • 22
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Travis Beck Don't forget about that firefight outside of Macaroon. The way he went after that former Selous Scout because he can't stand crackers, that was messed up.
August 23, 2012 at 12:04pm via mobile • Like • 1
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Larry Correia Our biggest problem in the field was that his bright blue fur stuck out in the desert... There isn't much stealth when C.W. is working. We'd roll up fast. Hit the enemy hard. Cookie Monster is a straight up door kicker. Man... He's quick. Last of the gun slingers we called him. I remember standing over this pile of corpses one time, and I was shaking, and I said "Why do we do this, man?" and what he said to me has lingered ever since... "C IS FOR COOKIE. THAT'S GOOD ENUF FOR ME!"

Words of wisdom, man... Words of wisdom...
August 23, 2012 at 12:05pm • Like • 31
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Travis Beck At one point there was talk of getting him a ghillie suit made of snuffleupagus hide. Did that ever work out?
August 23, 2012 at 12:07pm via mobile • Like • 4
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Larry Correia Yes. We requisitioned snuffleupagus hide from Locks Of Love.
August 23, 2012 at 12:09pm • Like • 10
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Nick Gardner I still have nightmares about what he did for that tin of shortbread.
*SHUDDER*
August 23, 2012 at 12:09pm via mobile • Like • 1
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Travis Beck If ever a smores-eater personified "Front Towards Enemy" it was the Big C.
August 23, 2012 at 12:12pm via mobile • Like • 1
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Adam Meyers • Friends with Howard Tayler and 4 others
Speaking as a professional actor, I know all the arguments about patronage and the need for art to, every now and then, seek for art regardless of whether it will be profitable or not. I also know that patronage is how once-educational programs turn into political machines, and how the quality of artwork steadily drops due to not needing to actually be good to keep being funded. If Seasame Street, after all its backing and groundbreaking, can't survive loss of Federal funding, then maybe its time it died and was replaced by a new groundbreaking kids show.
August 23, 2012 at 12:13pm • Like • 7
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Travis Beck Wasn't the Shortbread Protocol developed over Macho Grande?
August 23, 2012 at 12:14pm via mobile • Like • 1
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Philip Perrey • Friends with Larry Correia
Travis, no, we won't ever be over Macho Grande.
August 23, 2012 at 12:20pm • Like • 2
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Larry Correia Shortbread Protocol... It hurts to remember.

The target was a Romanian, real numbers man... Had a code name, The Count. He had the codes. We had to make him talk.

We waterboarded that puppet for hours. I can still hear their voices.

"WHAT IS CODE?"
August 23, 2012 at 12:21pm • Like • 15
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Larry Correia "ONE. HAW HAW HAW. TWO. HAW HAW HAW."
August 23, 2012 at 12:22pm • Like • 11
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Larry Correia "COOKIE IS NOT SOMETIMES FOOD!"

It was horrible... Just horrible...
August 23, 2012 at 12:22pm • Like • 5
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Brad Torgersen I must say, this thread is by far the funniest damned thing I have read in a long, long time. LOL! My had is off, all.
August 23, 2012 at 12:22pm • Like • 7
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Jon Summers • Friends with Oleg Volk and 1 other
If Cookie Monster and Grover are the "Front line operators" ... does that mean Big bird and Snuffleupagus are the sniper team? I mean, they do already have built in ghillie suits.

I can see it now "Seal Team: Sesame Street... the mockumentary!"
August 23, 2012 at 12:26pm • Like • 4
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Jesse Lambert • 7 mutual friends
I heard CM wore a necklace made from the oatmeal raisin cookies that he took off the dead.
August 23, 2012 at 12:27pm • Like • 4
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Chris Casper • Friends with Oleg Volk and 3 others
I was part of NATO forces in the Balkans. I can confirm that "the Monster" was active in the region. The after action reports were... Horror. Sheer, pure horror.
August 23, 2012 at 12:27pm via mobile • Like • 4
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Steve Gasper • Friends with Larry Correia and 1 other
Awesome!
August 23, 2012 at 12:28pm • Like
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Robert Langham Kids don't need to know how to build bombs?
August 23, 2012 at 12:31pm • Like
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Chris Casper • Friends with Oleg Volk and 3 others
There are unconfirmed reports that the Monster wiped out an entire Russian outpost near Pristine. The Russians just disappeared overnight... Just vanished... Like cookies anywhere near The Monster. NATO HQ heard nothing until it was all over. It was a mountain facility, but the locals swore they could hear the screaming of the VDV. We found no traces except for gas masks and random scraps of equipment. God knows what happened in that hole...
August 23, 2012 at 12:34pm via mobile • Like • 4
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Anthony Sadowski • 6 mutual friends
I think I saw CM in the a-stan there was word of am IAF hit team terrorizing a small remote village we were told big C was handing it
Later at a shura with the tribel elders they said to thank their savior and told us they had pulled together a payment from usaid packages i never saw some many oreos and choc chip cookies in one place ever.
August 23, 2012 at 12:39pm via mobile • Like • 3
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Jesse Lambert • 7 mutual friends
One time CM came to me and asked if I could do an under-barrel Easy Bake oven for his M4. I said "Sure, but why?". And then he told me.

I did it because I needed the money. I tell myself that if I hadn't built it for him someone else would have. That doesn't stop the nightmares though.
August 23, 2012 at 12:41pm • Like • 8
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Nick Gardner How many others are picturing Big Bird saying "The horror?"
August 23, 2012 at 12:43pm via mobile • Like • 2
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Amelia Ritner • Friends with Larry Correia
Doesn't Sesame Street make enough money in product sales to fund itself?
August 23, 2012 at 12:43pm • Like
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Nick Gardner Jon, Grover is not an operator. Didn't you ever see the films of the protests? Grover throwing his medals over the White House fence?
August 23, 2012 at 12:46pm via mobile • Like • 1
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Larry Correia Jesse... You were the one that made EZ Bake? Man... CM would just sit there sometimes, talking to that thing like it was alive. He freaked us out sometimes.

Cookie Monster was never the same after Elmo got redacted. Torture Me Elmo some of the guys called him. C.M. never laughed at that one...
August 23, 2012 at 12:46pm • Like • 10
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Larry Correia Grover is a poser. Grove pisses me off. Grover is the reason we have Stolen Valor. They said we tried to Swift Boat Grover, but the only reason he got a purple heart was because HE WAS PURPLE!
August 23, 2012 at 12:47pm • Like • 6
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Chris DeBoe • 5 mutual friends
When the after action report includes the word "purée", you know it was Big Blue.
August 23, 2012 at 12:49pm • Like • 3
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Chris DeBoe • 5 mutual friends
There was the occasion in Tzfrjkistan, when I was in the 120mm mortar crew. I still can remember the call: "Fire for effect, one round, double chocolate chip..."
August 23, 2012 at 12:54pm • Like • 2
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Chris Casper • Friends with Oleg Volk and 3 others
Jesus, Jesse. THAT WAS YOU? Do you have ANY CLUE what you did?
August 23, 2012 at 12:54pm • Like • 2
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Larry Correia Jesse, how can you sleep at night?
August 23, 2012 at 12:55pm • Like • 1
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Larry Correia You should have seen what Cookie Monster did with Old EZ Bake when we invaded Nick Jr.
August 23, 2012 at 12:55pm • Like • 5
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Matt Sorrell • Friends with Larry Correia and 1 other
I'll never eat another sugar cookie as long as I live. I just. . . . . can't. Not with those memories
August 23, 2012 at 12:57pm • Like • 1
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Nick Gardner "PTSD is terrible illness that can affect any person or puppet who's been in combat. If you suspect anyone you know is suffering from it, please, urge them to get help."

This message brought to you by the letters W, T and F, and the number 8.
August 23, 2012 at 1:08pm via mobile • Like • 8
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Travis Beck CM couldn't be trusted with sensitive intel, though. Remember what happened to that laptop we found at Tora Bora? I never could get through to him that tracking cookiees weren't softbaked.
August 23, 2012 at 1:30pm via mobile • Like • 3
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Peter Nealen • Friends with Tom Kratman and 4 others
We had to go into a village in Zaidon after CM got through with it. The blood... the crumbs... I told myself that the bastards deserved it... Still can't get it out of my head...
August 23, 2012 at 1:44pm • Like
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Tom Hamrick • Friends with Robert Langham
I thought they had changed from PBS to the CSTN? And We still pay for it.
August 23, 2012 at 2:09pm • Like
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Brad Torgersen (laughter, literally, big loud laughter....)
August 23, 2012 at 2:09pm • Like • 2
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Brenna McGruder Rawson • 3 mutual friends
I never liked Grover anyways. I bet Snuffy is for Romney!
August 23, 2012 at 2:31pm • Like • 1
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Conrad Ray • Friends with Larry Correia and 4 others
Were you there when Bert got hit? We were in this little village and Bert stepped on a bouncing betty. He was down, screaming, stuffing everywhere. We're trying to hold him down, stop the bleeding and frantically calling for a medevac. Just as the helo's dusting off with Bert I see CM walk into this bakery. He didn't even go for the cookies. Just straight into the flour. He came out with it caked around his nose. His eyes were pinholes. I don't know how he didn't OD and drop right there. He started going from house to house, kicking doors and... it was bad. He did the whole village. He just kept saying, "If they didn't plant it, they know who did."

He scares the piss out of me. When he's running on cookies it's bad enough. When he goes straight on the uncut flour,.. man, I just don't want to talk about it.

The thing is, he projects this image like he's hard, like a chips ahoy. But he's got soft layers, like an oreo. I really think he's hurt by what he's seen and what he's done. Now he's damaged goods. Just the crumbs left in the bottom of the tray. Would I work with him again? I don't know. I just don't know.
August 23, 2012 at 3:00pm • Like • 10
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Janet L. Pedersen • Friends with Larry Correia
Ah, the muppets are upset because the Republican ticket supports the traditional definition of marriage. They're afraid Miss Piggy and Kermit will have to go underground...
August 23, 2012 at 3:12pm • Like
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John Lane • Friends with Mark Wandrey and 4 others
Sometimes things just don't make sense, because one thing is not like the others. Did you ever find the Rainbow Connection? I know you were deep in the swamp looking for it.
August 23, 2012 at 3:24pm • Like • 1
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John Lane • Friends with Mark Wandrey and 4 others
They waterboarded Ernie, and he gave up the double agent. "Rubber Ducky! Rubber Ducky, you're the one..."
August 23, 2012 at 3:32pm • Like • 2
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Megan Rogers • Friends with Phil Sevetson
When the constitution was formed only white, propertied men ( like Romney) had voting rights. Times have changed. Unless you want to return to an oligarchy, the government is obligated to do it's utmost to educate it's citizens.
August 23, 2012 at 3:43pm • Like
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Larry Correia I'm not sure who made up more bullshit this thread, all of the Cookie Monster adventures or what Megan just said there...

If your children's education is predicated upon PBS being government funded, you have my pity.
August 23, 2012 at 3:55pm • Unlike • 10
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David Burkhead Funny, my daughter, at eight, is reading at a level where "grade level" is essentially meaningless. She did that without ever watching PBS and watching, at most, three or four episodes of Sesame Street on DVD. If government funding of PBS is so all fired important, how was she able to do that?

Oh, and as for arguments based on "times have changed" I point out that those "white, propertied men" put into that Constitution means for changing it relative to changing times. It's called the Amendment process. If you want to change it, then amend it properly. If Federal educational funding is so obviously important it shouldn't be difficult to convince 2/3 of each House of Congress and 3/4 of State legislatures to agree. If you can't, then maybe the "benefit" isn't so obvious as you think.

The modern Department of Education was founded in 1979. I have seen little evidence that it's made things _better_. PBS itself has only existed since 1970. Folk who weren't "educated" by the federal department of education and PBS were only capable of little things like, oh, to give just one example, going to the friggin' Moon. People who benefited from the Federal Department of Education and PBS have made such great accomplishments as, well, _not_ going to the Moon.

I remain unconvinced that "times have changed" in this instance (Federal funding of education and "educational programming") are actually changes for the better. The evidence before the bench would seem to point the other way.
August 23, 2012 at 4:10pm • Like
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Everitt Mickey That ad alone is reason to defund PBS. And I think it's a GREAT lesson.
August 23, 2012 at 4:10pm • Unlike • 2
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T Michael Hast • 12 mutual friends
Don't you just love it when public radio and public TV do their annual guilt-trip fund drive? If they weren't already taking my money via taxes, I might be inclined to contribute. Maybe. As it is, get bent.
August 23, 2012 at 4:39pm • Like • 1
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Philip Docfather Wohlrab Man I was a Medic on a CST in Iraq, we were heading over towards Al Assad and running through Fallujah. Little did we know CM had heard there was a stash of thin mints going through MSR Mobile in a bongo......There were bongo trucks everywhere all burn out and shit.....The stuff I was doing man trying to hold stuffing in..... I ran through my main aid bag and then had to hit up my secondary and the CLS bags. Biggest MASSCAL I have ever seen. We had the Dust offs coming in in waves an in waves. I just couldn't do it afterwards.
August 23, 2012 at 5:06pm • Like
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Jered Van Tuyl • 13 mutual friends
So, what's the downside with that poster?
August 23, 2012 at 9:10pm • Like
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Megan Rogers • Friends with Phil Sevetson
David, I presume that you are college educated, relatively well off, bought books for your daughter and read to her frequently. Now imagine the parent who does not even have a GED, who is working three jobs, who can't afford books for her daughter at Barnes and Noble and who does not read well herself. This woman is likely so exhausted that when she is with her children she uses the TV as a babysitter. What do you hope her child watches? Will it be a rerun of Threes Company, a violent cop show, reality TV or Sesame Street? I know which one I would pick. Three of these junk shows belong together. Three of these shows are kinda the same. But one of these shows just doesn't belong here. Now it's time to play our game....
August 23, 2012 at 9:13pm • Like
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Mark Tickler • Friends with Larry Correia
Well, maybe "If you would have peace, be prepared for war" is a valid lesson as well, no?
August 23, 2012 at 9:22pm • Like • 1
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David Burkhead "Now imagine a parent who..." is going to need a lot more than PBS to make any significant difference.
August 23, 2012 at 9:26pm • Like • 2
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Everitt Mickey three jobs? wonder why she had a kid.
August 23, 2012 at 9:46pm • Like
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David Burkhead Ev, it was her _right_!
August 23, 2012 at 9:46pm • Like
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Everitt Mickey David...oh yeah. Silly me.
August 23, 2012 at 9:47pm • Like
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Jered Van Tuyl • 13 mutual friends
So why does it become the responsibility of us as taxpayers to babysit a child for someone who makes poor choices?
August 23, 2012 at 9:58pm • Like • 2
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David Burkhead Jered Van Tuyl, because it's her _right!_
August 23, 2012 at 10:04pm • Like
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Tedd SpeakertoLabanimals Roberts The negative commentors are missing the fact that the poster basically *lies* Sesame Street is self-funded out of their own [Big Corporate] profits on merchandising.
August 23, 2012 at 10:06pm • Unlike • 3
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Tedd SpeakertoLabanimals Roberts So, if PBS is defunded - they can either stop producing their educational shows and just become a toy merchandizer - which would simply reveal the hypocrisy in the criticism above
August 23, 2012 at 10:07pm • Unlike • 2
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Everitt Mickey I'm wondering just how "educational' Sesame street IS. I'm wondering if maybe they be teaching kiddo's stuff the parents don't really care for.
August 23, 2012 at 10:08pm • Unlike • 1
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Tedd SpeakertoLabanimals Roberts or they can take their educational programs to other outlets. They don't have to have PBS to be educational. In fact, they only thing educational about PBS these days is the education you get when you realize that the whining fundraisers are already getting your tax money!
August 23, 2012 at 10:08pm • Unlike • 1
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Megan Rogers • Friends with Phil Sevetson
I am not describing a fictitious person. My son holds a 50 hour a week factory job making $9.00/ hour. If he works there a full year he will be entitled to a half a week of vacation. A coworker of his does his same job and two others. You might think because she is poor it is immoral of her to have kids that she can't afford. I view it as immoral of America to allow companies to pay wages so low that their workers with families are forced to work twice as hard as you and me hour work wejust to make ends meet. Also, what about the child who did not choose to be born into poverty. Do you want a government that does nothing to try to stop the cycle of poverty? Of course Sesame Street is not enough. The government needs to spend far more on programs to educate our youth. You are advocating that our government stop the programs that we know are helpful for kids.
August 23, 2012 at 10:36pm • Like
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Larry Correia I'm sorry. I couldn't hear you over all the liberal hand wringing.
August 23, 2012 at 11:21pm via mobile • Like • 3
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Everitt Mickey Megan... go to russia and see how well socialism worked....
August 23, 2012 at 11:30pm • Like
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Drew Hamilton • Friends with Larry Correia
Maybe the kids should go to school and learn something there.... Hell even take the money from pbs and give it to the schools. Though parents should be teaching the kids they have something, instead of letting the tv raise them.
August 23, 2012 at 11:46pm • Like • 1
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Chuck Wohlrab • Friends with Philip Docfather Wohlrab
Considering Sesame Street is worth well over a billion dollars can anyone explain to me just why Grover and his pals need to drink from the public trough???
August 24, 2012 at 12:06am • Like • 2
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Ted Hall • 14 mutual friends
Megan: I am not describing a fictitious person.

Then perhaps you ought to be doing something about it... are you babysitting now and then so the poor woman can look for a better job?

Have you stocked the pantry for her this month?

Do you really think that anything YOU aren't doing for her knowing of the situation personally ought to be OUR responsibility?
August 24, 2012 at 12:20am • Like • 2
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Drew Hamilton • Friends with Larry Correia
Ummmm good point Chuck.....
August 24, 2012 at 12:20am • Like
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James Bell • Friends with John Ringo and 4 others
So why can't PBS sell advertising like ABC NBC et al?
Where does all that money that the Merchandizing from Sesame St. makes go?
August 24, 2012 at 4:37am • Like
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Matthew Bowman "I view it as immoral of America to allow companies to pay wages so low that their workers with families are forced to work twice as hard as you and me hour work wejust to make ends meet."

I view it as silly to assume that a job meant for a single person supporting only himself should be expected to pay for an entire family. There are jobs that pay more, but you have to qualify for them. You don't have a "right" to a job; you have to earn the pay you're provided.

Yes, it's hard to get one of those jobs. It's REALLY hard in the last few years, in fact. Since -- when was it? 2009? No, wait, it was the tail end of 2008, right after the stock market tanked in early November. Apparently investors got some bad news on Wednesday, November 5th.

I wonder what happened the day before? Hmmm . . .
August 24, 2012 at 1:34pm • Like
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Wayne Joseph Borean Actually the United States is not broke. The major problem is that certain groups have worked to ensure that they don't pay taxes. Fix the tax Scofflaw problem, and you've got lots of cash.

As to Sesame Street, and other educational programs, they pay off by improving the earning power of the kids that watch them, meaning they'll pay more in taxes. Government supported Educational efforts are actually a damned good investment, which helps provide educated workers, and improves society.

Oh, and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics was socialist in name only. It was a dictatorship pure and simple, dedicated to supplying a small elite with luxuries, and keeping the rest of the population as virtual slaves.
August 24, 2012 at 1:59pm via mobile • Like
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David Burkhead "The major problem is that certain groups have worked to ensure that they don't pay taxes." This kind of comment is _exactly_ why we need folk on office who can do math. It's empty rhetoric, no more.

Take the growth of Social Security. Just that one aspect of the budget. Take the growth of the GDP (averaged over a long enough baseline to smooth out the shorter cycles). Put them on the same graph. In a surprisingly short time, if nothing major happens to change either curve, Social Security will pass GDP. No taxes in the world will save it then. Of course, _something_ will change before then.

"They pay off by improving the earning power of the kids that watch them." Cite? Any evidence whatsoever for this claim? I mean, even explicit programs such as Head Start have been shown to have zero effect by third grade.

"The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics was socialist in name only." Why yes. Along with every other "socialist/communist" nation. There. is. a. reason. for. this.
August 24, 2012 at 2:06pm • Like • 1
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Matthew Bowman Socialism: an idea so popular, so efficient, so fair . . . you have to force others into it against their will!

I find the math issue hilarious. If you raised taxes to 100% on the Evil Rich, you wouldn't even pay for a year of the federal budget -- much less pay down the debt!
August 24, 2012 at 2:52pm • Like
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Matthew Bowman http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=661pi6K-8WQ For those who don't actually want to do the math themselves . . .

EAT THE RICH!
www.youtube.com
Is America really broke? Michael Moore (and others) tells us that there are ocea...See More
August 24, 2012 at 2:53pm • Like • Remove Preview
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Wayne Joseph Borean Sweden is a socialist country. No one forced them.

As to education - a while back a Korean company that I used to deal with bought a plant in Wales. When I asked one of the North American managers why they did that, he responded that the locals were better educated and trained then the workers in Korea, and it was less expensive to operate the plant because the workforce was healthy (government run medical system), and the company didn't have buy expensive health insurance, because the government run system was far less costly.

Sorry, can't tell you who it was - I'm still covered by a bunch of non-disclosure agreements.
August 24, 2012 at 3:25pm via mobile • Like
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David Burkhead "as to education" But we're not talking about education. We're talking about "educational programming." The claim was that "educational programming" paid off down the road.

"government run system was far less costly" Lot's of things are less costly when you get someone _else_ to pay for them.
August 24, 2012 at 3:40pm • Like
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Matthew Bowman And a lot of things are better when you start from a lower standard. Have you BEEN to South Korea? This is a country that puts warning labels on electric fans because the populace believes if you run them in a closed room it will somehow eat up all the oxygen.

My sister is from South Korea (adopted) and has zero desire to go back. They've got a few really modern-looking spots and that's about it. Pretty country, fascinating cultural heritage, really low down on the totem pole of education and industry. When you're at a fifth-grade education level and have twenty bucks to your name, almost everyone seems smarter and richer.

Also, regarding Sweden: notice how many people are flocking to Sweden? And how many people are leaving -- or never getting born?
August 24, 2012 at 3:49pm • Like
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James Bell • Friends with John Ringo and 4 others
He is right tho, there are around 50% of US adults who in the end pay no taxes and yet still get benefits.
August 24, 2012 at 5:45pm via mobile • Like
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Wayne Joseph Borean Education is partly about attitude. Sesame Street and other educational programs teach that attitude.

There are a lot of people who think education is worthless. A lot of them are uneducated.
August 24, 2012 at 8:53pm via mobile • Like
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Matthew Bowman A lot of people think Sesame Street is educational. A lot of them don't actually watch it.

I remember a very large swath of educational programs when I was a child. I see almost nothing today to even match what I enjoyed and learned from. Sesame Street wasn't one of those. Oh, I watched it; but for entertainment, not education. And even then, there were better things on TV.

But the purpose here isn't to debate Sesame Street's worthiness, is it? Simply whether it might survive a funding cut for PBS. Which, of course, it would. Whatever my opinion of the show, it has full financial viability.
August 24, 2012 at 8:58pm • Like
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David Burkhead And you continue to make suppositions. I asked if you had _evidence_ to back up the claim that "they pay off by improving the earning power of kids that watch them." Evidence. Repeatedly asserting that they accomplish something is not evidence.

Look, maybe you're right. Maybe "educational TV" is the best thing since sliced bacon. But if folk want _my_ tax dollars to "support" it (even leaving aside that Sesame Street is self supporting and does _not_ rely on government dollars, despite what the image above claims), I want actual evidence that that's the case and not just supposition and assertions.

That's particularly the case when another program designed to aid young children with learning, this one actually paid with tax dollars--Head Start--has been demonstrated most clearly not to work. By third grade children who have been through Head Start are indistinguishable from children from similar backgrounds who did not go through it. It has no lasting effect at all. (But just try cancelling it and watch the screams. "It's for the children!" They say. "How can you be so heartless!" They say. The fact that it doesn't actually _do_ anything to help the children doesn't seem to matter.)

So I want evidence, not just nice sounding claims.
August 24, 2012 at 9:01pm • Like
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Wayne Joseph Borean There is evidence, but to a certain extent what it shows is that a lot of American "educational" programming is garbage. Did you know that "Little House on the Prairie" is considered educational?

http://www.childrennow.org/index.php/learn/educational_tv

Children Now—Children’s Educational TV
www.childrennow.org
ChildrenNow is a national organization for people who care about children and want to ensure that they are the top public priority.
August 24, 2012 at 9:22pm via mobile • Like • Remove Preview
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Wayne Joseph Borean And this:

http://www.education.com/reference/article/studies-support-benefits-educational-tv/

Studies Support Benefits of Educational TV for Reading | Education.com
www.education.com
Recent research has shown that educational programs, including Sesame Street can help to boost reading scores for early readers.
August 24, 2012 at 9:25pm via mobile • Like • Remove Preview
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David Burkhead Sure, and Head Start helps a bit in first and second grade too. But by Third Grade the difference vanishes. The claim was "earning power" (and therefore what they end up paying in taxes). Still waiting for evidence of what you actually claimed.
August 24, 2012 at 9:31pm • Like
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MockingBird TheWizard • Friends with Leo Champion
grover doesn't actually support obama, he was a bit nervous after seeing predator drones flying overhead right after he was "requested" to do the Ad.
Because, y'know, the bombs Obama built can be used without congressional approval or court order.
August 25, 2012 at 2:01pm • Like • 3
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Wayne Joseph Borean David, I'd really have to get my wife involved to explain in detail, she's the education specialist. According to her if it is done right (which means The Learning Channel does not count), it can make a huge difference.

Thing you have to remember is that Hellions are different. We have the urge and intelligence to learn on our own. Most people don't.

Another issue is the Educational system of the country. Most Canadian companies I know avoid hiring Americans, because they have to be retrained. As a traveling salesman I spent a lot of time in the Continental states. Americans a not stupid, but they are badly under-educated compared to Canadians on average. The Brits are bad too, except the upper class types.

Basically you need a holistic solution, and most countries (including Canada) are not willing to spend the money to get it.
August 25, 2012 at 8:18pm via mobile • Like
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Nora MacFie • Friends with Johan Ahrgren and 3 others
@Wayne: Just a quick response about Canada as opposed to America in education. One of my son's classmates last year moved here from Canada and the standards had been so low in Kindergarten that he's having to repeat first grade here in Southern California.
August 28, 2012 at 11:02pm • Like • 1
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Brad Torgersen Late to the thread. It's a shame Obama doesn't have a positive record to run on. However, since Obama's record is terrible, we have distractions. Distractions, distractions, distractions. Trillion dollar deficits? No, wait, Romney wants to cook Big Bird in the oven for Thankgsiving! I say, pass the salt and the gravy boat, brother.
October 26, 2012 at 5:35pm • Like • 1
 
 
 
kalimeg -- TBkalimeg on July 14th, 2013 02:55 pm (UTC)
As to that pore lady with the 3 kids -- she lived in TX and no one wanted to adopt children of her race....